Where did the "opera singers are viking women" stereotype come from?!
Question: Where did the "opera singers are viking women" stereotype come from!?
I have always seen this, especially on cartoons!. I'm an aspiring opera singer (well, it's more of a hobby lol) & I don't ascribe to the stereotype!. Where did it come from!?Www@Enter-QA@Com
Answers:
Quite simply it comes from the character of Brünnehilde in Wagner's opera the Ring of the Nebulung!.
The character is based on Norse mythology!. Brynhildr, as she is known in the Norse legend, is a shieldmaiden !.!.!. a servant of Odin!.
In Wagner's Ring Cycle, Siegfried slays the the dragon!. Then enters the castle and awakens Brünnehilde by removing her helmet and cutting off her chainmail armour!.
He falls in love at first sight and proposes marriage to her with the magic ring!.
!.!.!. Alberich, our resident Wagner expert, can probably explain it much better!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
The character is based on Norse mythology!. Brynhildr, as she is known in the Norse legend, is a shieldmaiden !.!.!. a servant of Odin!.
In Wagner's Ring Cycle, Siegfried slays the the dragon!. Then enters the castle and awakens Brünnehilde by removing her helmet and cutting off her chainmail armour!.
He falls in love at first sight and proposes marriage to her with the magic ring!.
!.!.!. Alberich, our resident Wagner expert, can probably explain it much better!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
"i!.jones", you are much too kind; and I don't consider myself to be an "expert" on Wagner: far from it!. It's just that no composer's music stirrs, moves my soul, as Wagner's does; and have over the course of a lifetime, tried to familiarize myself with his works, and life experiences!.
I don't know really what I can add, that may possess any real value: several of your responders has already correctly identified the source: Wagner's great "Ring" cycle, and one of its two principal characters, "Brunnhilde"!.
And would only point out, that it seems to me, such dipiction(s) in a commercial - or any comedic form - is to "mock" or "ridicule", in order to sell something!. I can assure you, a real Wagnerite, such as much, is not laughing!.
And the reference to Hitler, I would agree with; he adored Wagner's music(proposed twice to the widow of his son, Siegfried, during the Natzi reign of terror)!. But the identifying of the Natzi's with Wagner, is illegitimate: Richard, would probably turn over in his grave!.
Finally, it's been my life expericene, that sometimes, great art usually takes long exposure and a concentrated attempt to comprehend, in order to be appreciated; and therefore unfortunately, not readily accessible to the uneducated masses!.
So that, in the case of Wagner's Ring, to ridicule and mock, is resorted to only because it's beyond the comprehension of those who presume to; and is an attempt on their part, to compensate for their feelings of resultant inferiority, because of their inability to comprehend its artistic merit!.
I realize that to some, I may be coming over as a "pompous snob", but I felt the need to respond,express myself: could not have ignored "i!.jones" remarks, could I!?
Alberich
P!.S!.-"i!.jones": your "bait" was too alluring!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
I don't know really what I can add, that may possess any real value: several of your responders has already correctly identified the source: Wagner's great "Ring" cycle, and one of its two principal characters, "Brunnhilde"!.
And would only point out, that it seems to me, such dipiction(s) in a commercial - or any comedic form - is to "mock" or "ridicule", in order to sell something!. I can assure you, a real Wagnerite, such as much, is not laughing!.
And the reference to Hitler, I would agree with; he adored Wagner's music(proposed twice to the widow of his son, Siegfried, during the Natzi reign of terror)!. But the identifying of the Natzi's with Wagner, is illegitimate: Richard, would probably turn over in his grave!.
Finally, it's been my life expericene, that sometimes, great art usually takes long exposure and a concentrated attempt to comprehend, in order to be appreciated; and therefore unfortunately, not readily accessible to the uneducated masses!.
So that, in the case of Wagner's Ring, to ridicule and mock, is resorted to only because it's beyond the comprehension of those who presume to; and is an attempt on their part, to compensate for their feelings of resultant inferiority, because of their inability to comprehend its artistic merit!.
I realize that to some, I may be coming over as a "pompous snob", but I felt the need to respond,express myself: could not have ignored "i!.jones" remarks, could I!?
Alberich
P!.S!.-"i!.jones": your "bait" was too alluring!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
I think it came from some of Wagner's works!. You have to remember that many of these stereotypical cartoons started in the 40's & 50's and were probably poking fun at Hitler, who loved Wagner's operas!.
If you read the synopsis of Das Rheingold and some of the other works in the Ring cycle, it's easy to imagine the cliched Norse diva in this setting!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
If you read the synopsis of Das Rheingold and some of the other works in the Ring cycle, it's easy to imagine the cliched Norse diva in this setting!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
From the Valkyres in the Wagner Ring Cycle!.
The Valkyres were the 9 daughters of Wotan, the king of the gods, who rescued wounded warriors from the battlefield!.
Since many people cannot read a big word past the first letter, the two get confused!.
On TV, there was a football game in which a float in an image of a Viking ship was brought out at halftime while the band played The Ride of the Valkyres!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
The Valkyres were the 9 daughters of Wotan, the king of the gods, who rescued wounded warriors from the battlefield!.
Since many people cannot read a big word past the first letter, the two get confused!.
On TV, there was a football game in which a float in an image of a Viking ship was brought out at halftime while the band played The Ride of the Valkyres!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
from losers!. vikings didnt even wear that type of helmet we see as the stereotypical viking helmet that the "opera women" wear!.
I dont like the stereotype, I love opera and have never seen anyone in such a fashion!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
I dont like the stereotype, I love opera and have never seen anyone in such a fashion!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
DEFINITELY Wagner, as listed above!. Huge soprano voices with very demanding roles, clad in viking outfits; the stereotype still sticks to this day!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
See also What's Opera, Doc!? by the great social critic Chuck Jones!.Www@Enter-QA@Com
From Wagner and the character Brunhilde, mostly!. Isn't it Brunhilde singing in "Die Walkure"!? shows you how much Wagner I know --Www@Enter-QA@Com