Can I get all the regulars and anyother hip hop fans to check out this question?!
Question: I posted a buy or sell question the other day askin if the underground is better than the mainstream (in today's time). And for the most part I had people agree, but one comment stuck out to me from Holiday Dilla:
"my feeling has always been, that you can start out underground...hell even be there for five years, but if your music aint out for the masses, then what good is it to me.../ they [mainstream] got something about them that is appealing to the masses"
now my question is for anybody who agrees with this statement... If you believe that statement, than can you really complain about all the soulja boy's and DJ UNK's and MIMS' that we have out now? Cuz I mean, that's whats appealing to the masses, thats what the record labels feel is hot- you know??? I'm not tryin to start no huge rift or nothin like that cuz *I KNOW* there's talent in the mainstream, just like its garbage in the underground... but what I am sayin is, you only gettin what you asked for...
Answers: I posted a buy or sell question the other day askin if the underground is better than the mainstream (in today's time). And for the most part I had people agree, but one comment stuck out to me from Holiday Dilla:
"my feeling has always been, that you can start out underground...hell even be there for five years, but if your music aint out for the masses, then what good is it to me.../ they [mainstream] got something about them that is appealing to the masses"
now my question is for anybody who agrees with this statement... If you believe that statement, than can you really complain about all the soulja boy's and DJ UNK's and MIMS' that we have out now? Cuz I mean, that's whats appealing to the masses, thats what the record labels feel is hot- you know??? I'm not tryin to start no huge rift or nothin like that cuz *I KNOW* there's talent in the mainstream, just like its garbage in the underground... but what I am sayin is, you only gettin what you asked for...
Yeah they have something appealing to the masses, dumbed down music that offers instant gratification but gets played out in a matter of time and doesn't retain the timeless quality that a true artist has.
Good rappers aren't going mainstream not because they don't have the talent to, but because they don't get breaks. You think that a Nas coming up right now would break into the mainstream? There is no chance, he would be underground and people would be saying that there is something he lacks right now.
You know what all the DJ Unk's and Souljah Boy's (not MIMS, he's actually not bad) have that a lot of (not all of) the underground artists lack? It's the other way around. Underground artists make ART, Unk and Souljah Boy are just having fun.
I don't know if it's because the people buy it or the industry sells it without any alternative, but it seems like all the people want nowadays is immediate pleasure, because they know next month someone will come out with a new song.
I still enjoy my underground rap albums that came out in the beginning of the year, but if you ask a typical mainstream fan if they still like Huey, they will say that he is old.
None of what I said applies to those in the mainstream that have talent, but if you think about it, any mainstream act with talent has gotten to the mainstream under different circumstances that a rapper today would have to go through. Kanye was a great producer, and Lupe was close with Kanye. Jay-Z, Nas, and Wu-Tang are all from a different time in hip-hop and have more devoted fan bases. Where are the devoted fan bases for Young Joc?
Like I said, flash in the pan, saying that they got something about them that is appealing to the masses is implying that that is a GOOD THING.
i feel as though there are two different types of rappers there are some just out to get thats paper and some that want to get their message out and if they happen to get payed along the way then so be it!
yah, i get wat that person is sayin. but sometimes itz with the record labels cuz, don't they control what comes out on the radio sometimes or whateva, so if they feel like dj unk, the masses are gonna get dj unk no matta if we like him or not. same wit the underground. they can have good songz out there that a lotta pplz may like but if the record label doesn't think that that iz what the mass is gonna think hot then i don't think they're gonna pick it up. oh yeah, and plus it dependz on the ppl. like they see that dj unk n soulja boy n hurricane chris are doing good in the mainstream so itz like, let's keep gettin ppl like them to maintain that instead of pulling out somebody different.
yeah, i wrote an article about this. This is what ppl choose to see. They would rather see Soulja Boy dancing around than a "concscious rapper"....My point is that this is the way ppl, black and white (who make up 75% of mainstream rap consumers), choose to see people of color, it has obvious appeal. The real question is why.
i'm 15 years old so i know what i'm talking about. most people my age don't know what real rap is. all the ringtone rappers are aimed at the teens cuz we're the ones who are the most promimnent listeners of rap in the present. Old people (no offense but when i say old i mean 20+) were around with tupac and biggie and all the other amazing lyricists around "back in the day". mainstream is appealing to the masses because the masses of rap fans are mostly teenagers who haven't cared enough to find out that there were better lyricists back then and rap wasn't all about a quick easy dollar.
thats why ringtone rappers are so popular. because the majority of rap fans doesn't know there is anything better
I disagree with the statement. A lot of whats out now may appeal to the masses but USUALLY these people end up being one-hit wonders. That is why people talk about hip-hop/rap like its a fad nowadays. Who cares if they're appealing to the masses? some of them are making people who started listening to hip-hop by listening to that artist [Yes, I know people who started listening to rap because of Soulja Boy] think thats all there is to expect from the genre.
The media especially likes to exploit it then once its over exposed its a big joke to people.Which is why 'real hip-hop heads' complain and always compare todays rap music to the greats. Im not saying eff mass appeal Im just saying not all the people that make it into mainstream have uber talent but they just fit into what fad is going on currently. You feel me?
Me personally I see nothing wrong with listening to a little fad rap from time to time. I have superman'd a ho or two to 'Crank Dat' more than once Its fun.. but do I support it? Hell nah.
I agree... I know some people that're truly conscious rappers, but they want to make it big... So, in order for them to be big, they feel like they have to make dance and ringtone songs so that they'll get some recognition and be signed.
They feel like if they do that and are successful, then they can slowly wean away from that type of music and become the conscious rappers that they truly are. But I don't think that would work out to well because as you said... It wouldn't be alluring to the masses.
I don't agree with everything in his statement, but I can understand what he's saying. Most people are passive, whatever is out there, they will take it, especially when it comes to something like music. For example, Dj Unk was underground at a point and no one cared, he came out on a major record label, got some promotion and he had his time to shine. Anyone can appeal to the masses (even the most underground artist) if they receive enough promotion, have some good marketing behind them or (in this era) make at least one ring tone/iTUNES song. I'm not sure if I answered your question, but that's what I think.
No disrespect to Holiday Dilla.
I think that a lot of the best underground can cross over. Common is the latest example. I first heard him about 2 1/2 years before he made it big. Sometimes there is great danceable and sometimes great meaningful mainstream music, like Outkast and Kanye and others.
But 90% of what I hear on the one and only hip hop radio station coming from Denver, CO (KS 107.5) is crap. It really bums me out that I can't even stand to listen to it for more than 15 minutes anymore. Excepting the one hour a day where they play old school jams.
I think that, like every genre of music, hip hop is going to have its highs and lows in terms of the quality and originality of its mainstream music. We are in a very low point right now.
Adds: And I disagree that because some music stays underground that it is not worthwhile. Some of that stuff is incredible, but it has a limited audience. That's o.k. I love all of my underground and old school hip-hop. My wife doesn't like it and does like the stuff they play on the radio. I think that's o.k.
I don't agree with that statement, because of marketing. The only reason that stuff is hot now because of the marketing push for it. The commercials, TV spots, payola. There has been music like that in the ATL area for years, and it didn't go nationwide. There was no push for it(from corperate america). When they marketed Conscious it was hot, likewise for Gansta, Trap, etc.
Im a SUPERSTAR!!!...I am *MAINSTREAM...THE REST OF YOU GUYS ARE UNDERGROUND*....LOL...j/k...And like you Aim...I gets money plus Im gangsta
here is my whole answer so peeps could see what I was talking about...
Sell...I like underground artist...but they are obviously lacking something that allows them to sign with a major label...And yeah I know some wanna stay underground...but not all of them...Just like the dudes who are raw as hell in college basketball...Some of them dont got what it takes to make it to the league...
Im not saying that I am a big fan of mainstream music either...Most of it is lame as hell, but my feeling has always been, that you can start out underground...hell even be there for five years, but if your music aint out for the masses, then what good is it to me...
Aim...you are asking about the underground though...And yes I know that there are a bunch of rappers who arent signed for spitting but they got something about them that is appealing to the masses....the underground rappers... even if they have the best lyrics, flow, punchlines, swagger, whatever...if the record company dont think its hot...you aint gonna get signed...
I can see the point. There's nothing wrong with a rapper with talent who has something to say wanting to reach as wide an audience as possible. I don't think mainstream automatically = selling out.
But then, look at Immortal Technique: it's not that he couldn't appeal to the masses, it's that he refuses to. Whether you like the guy's music or not, that deserves respect.
A love for music is such a personal thing that I don't see how an appeal to the masses really matters when rating an artist - it's only their appeal to YOU that counts.
Well see there are two kinds of rap: good and bad.
And there are two kinds of people who listen to rap: people with good taste and people with bad taste.
some people just wanna listen to some real *** stuff and vibe to it, and some just wanna jump up and down and superman that ***. People who really enjoy rap and understand what its about will just pop in a CD and let it ride, while they ride, or chill, or smoke, or drink what ever their "vice" as jay z would say
You know what I think? I think people just don't know what's music anymore. Forget hip-hop being dead, artists are urinating on hip-hop’s grave, what I’m concerned with is that it’s possible that no one in the music industry knows what music is. I don’t want to hear about your bling, bitches, ice, bathin' apes or your god damn " brand new dance"! What I want to hear is a composed track. I'm talking about no vocals unless it's opera. You know why I'm tired of all this Rihana and J-Lo pop princess nonsense? Well it's because they're voices are good, but they're talking garbage. Same applies to most rappers, they go pick up that Dr. Seuss green eggs and ham, hit them nursery rhymes and throw in some "dance" they saw a cocaine addict doing on 43rd.
I'm on my classical albums tip; I'm not that scene-kid you see in the club dancing to a song about someone else's money. I'm not that imitation-gangster you see at the block rocking FUBU and Nike like I don't have no original fashion sense. The way I see it, the masses keep asking for garbage, all everyone's going to get is garbage.